Legislature(2003 - 2004)
05/08/2004 12:04 PM House RLS
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
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+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
SB 190-KENAI RIVER SPECIAL MANAGEMENT AREA CHAIR ROKEBERG announced that the final order of business would be CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 190(STA), "An Act adding certain state-owned land and water to the Kenai River Special Management Area; relating to the mineral estate of the state-owned land and water in the Kenai River Special Management Area; relating to the Kenai River Special Management Area advisory board; and providing for an effective date." [Before the committee is HCS CSSB 190(CRA).] Number 0616 AMY SEITZ, Staff to Senator Thomas Wagoner, Alaska State Legislature, informed the committee that HCS CSSB 190(CRA) merely places the management of some 550 acres of land under the Kenai River Special Management Area (KRSMA). She explained that 536 acres of those lands were purchased by the state with Exxon Valdez oil spill (EVOS) settlement funds. These lands are primarily wetlands that are critical habitat areas. The remaining portion of the legislation is merely rewording and doesn't actually change what the statute does. MS. SEITZ, in response to Chair Rokeberg, explained that in 1984 the legislature decided that the Kenai River system was an important state resource that should be protected and preserved. Therefore, KRSMA was established as was an advisory board that would recommend how to manage those lands. Number 0748 CHAIR ROKEBERG asked if the sponsor approved the changes incorporated in HCS CSSB 190(CRA). MS. SEITZ replied no. In further response to Chair Rokeberg, Ms. Seitz addressed Amendment 1, which read [original punctuation provided]: Page 5, line 9, following " municipalities", insert "adjacent to the Kenai River" Page 5, line 10, Following "groups.", delete "An" insert "Unless appointed as a representative of a user group, resident property owners, a municipality adjacent to the Kenai River, or other interest group, an" Page 5, line 12, Following "board", insert "only as an ex officio member serving without a vote. Page 5, line 12, Following "of the", insert "voting" MS. SEITZ explained that the KRSMA board was established as a citizen advisory board. Therefore, the sponsor believes that making the state and federal agency members ex officio would make the KRSMA advisory board more of a citizen board while maintaining the knowledge of the state and federal agency members. The sponsor feels that those municipalities along the Kenai River are directly affected by the management of the river, and therefore those municipalities should have the privilege of voting. MS. SEITZ, in response to Representative Coghill, reiterated that the KRSMA advisory board was established as a citizen advisory board. Number 1003 JANET BURLESON-BAXTER, Legislative Liaison, Office of the Commissioner, Department of Natural Resources (DNR), explained that the KRSMA advisory board was established as an advisory board to the commissioner of DNR. She related that DNR supports the legislation, which adds the acreage to KRSMA that DNR supports. Furthermore, DNR is comfortable with the amendments. Ms. Burleson-Baxter expressed that DNR wants the expertise of its staff to be available to the advisory board and maintain an open communication with the KRSMA advisory board. The department believes that ex officio status preserves the aforementioned, and therefore the department is comfortable with such a change. In response to Chair Rokeberg, Ms. Burleson- Baxter confirmed that the matter is whether the agency members of the KRSMA advisory board can vote. Number 1090 REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL moved that the committee adopt Amendment 1 [text provided previously]. CHAIR ROKEBERG objected for discussion purposes. REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ pointed out that the legislation is written in the passive voice, and therefore he questioned who would make the appointment. MS. SEITZ replied that the commissioner of DNR would make the appointments and the commissioner of each agency would appoint a member from that agency. REPRESENTATIVE KERTTULA surmised that the desire is to keep the lines of communication open. Therefore, she further surmised that there would be the desire to have the agency members present so that the board members can have access to them, although the sponsor doesn't feel that it's necessary for the agency members to vote. She inquired as to how the KRSMA advisory board works. MS. SEITZ stated that the sponsor doesn't feel that the proposed change will change how the KRSMA advisory board acts. Under this proposed change, the sponsor feels that the citizens will depend on themselves with regard to advising DNR. Number 1257 REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ turned attention to Section 3 of HCS CSSB 190(CRA), and inquired as to the effect of changes to existing statute. MS. SEITZ answered that Section 3 doesn't change [existing statute], rather it is clarifying language. REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ asked if any of the land [being transferred] is currently under a lease. MS. BURLESON-BAXTER related her understanding that none of the land [being transferred] is currently under a lease. Furthermore, this section doesn't change how the lands acquired with the EVOS funds are managed because there are management restrictions on those lands. Whatever is the most restrictive would be the status. "If putting them within the KRSMA would somehow make them more open to this kind of development, that would not apply to them," she explained. Number 1349 REPRESENTATIVE KERTTULA asked if the EVOS status stops the land from being able to be leased. [MS. BURLESON-BAXTER indicated, by the shake of her head, no.] REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ recalled a letter in the committee packet that refers to 8,000 acres. MS. SEITZ explained that the new Kenai River comprehensive management plan that the KRSMA advisory board put together requested that just less than 8,000 acres be added into KRSMA. However, in the last legislature former Representative Ken Lancaster introduced legislation that added all the acreage [to which Representative Berkowitz referred]. Through the process it was determined that about 3,500 acres would have impacted the Chugach hydroelectric power plant in Cooper Landing. There were other problems with the other acreage. Therefore, the acreage identified in this legislation is the most critical and with the least complications. In further response to Representative Berkowitz, Ms. Seitz confirmed that it's possible that the acreage beyond that in this legislation's proposal would be sought. Number 1507 REPRESENTATIVE McGUIRE posed a situation in which the amendment isn't adopted, and asked if it would be possible for the entire citizen board to be made up of employees, elected officials, or representatives of the federal or state government. REPRESENTATIVE KERTTULA replied, theoretically, yes. MS. SEITZ confirmed that such hasn't happened yet. In response to Chair Rokeberg, Ms. Seitz also confirmed that only a majority of the members on the KRSMA advisory board have to be from the Kenai Peninsula Borough. In response to Representative Kerttula, Ms. Seitz agreed that there is no limit on the number of people who can be on this advisory board. She confirmed that the KRSMA advisory board has bylaws. CHAIR ROKEBERG related his assumption that the bylaws would limit the number of individuals that can be on this advisory board. REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ said he reads [existing statute] not to place a prohibition against employees, elected officials, or other representatives, whether from the federal or state government, from serving on this advisory board. Therefore, he inquired as to why this statute should be changed when it's already acceptable. CHAIR ROKEBERG opined that the issue is whether such individuals can vote or not. REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ asked if there is something that prohibits "them" from voting. MS. SEITZ highlighted the amendment. REPRESENTATIVE McGUIRE explained that in the House Community and Regional Affairs Standing Committee an amendment was made that took out the provision saying that an employee, elected official, or representative of the federal or state government could serve as an ex officio member without a vote. The aforementioned was the original intent of the legislation. Amendment 1 would capture the original intent, which Representative McGuire said she supported. CHAIR ROKEBERG asked if the legal description in the first portion of the legislation is merely a recitation of current law or does it change the boundaries in any way. MS. BURLESON-BAXTER related her understanding that the language merely adds the roughly 550 acres into [KRSMA]. However, she wasn't sure where the land is placed. Number 1805 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY WOLF, Alaska State Legislature, clarified, "The property set aside ... we currently, through the Department of Natural Resources, own the property." He noted that EVOS purchased it and it's under [the state's management]. Therefore, [this legislation] wouldn't change anything, rather it would merely [transfer the land] to another entity, the KRSMA advisory board. He explained that 14 years ago the KRSMA advisory board was created and consisted of 17 members. When the legislature enacted EO 107, which transferred the Division of Habitat from the Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G) to DNR, the ADF&G member was removed as a voting member. "The only Anchorage member ... on the KRSMA board, removed themselves as a voting member, according to the Department of Fish & Game," he related. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF related his understanding that the amendment would make three of the members of the KRSMA advisory board ex officio members. Those members are the representatives for U.S. Fish & Wildlife, U.S. Forest Service, and Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC). These three agency representatives are responsible for and have management authority for lands up and down the Kenai River, which is 84 miles of pristine, critical habitat area. Representative Wolf provided the committee with letters from members of the KRSMA advisory board. He opined that there has never been a situation in which the agency representatives have overrun the board. In fact, the agency representatives have brought credibility and talent to the advisory board. Therefore, he surmised that removing the voting ability from these members would remove their responsibility. Representative Wolf related that some of the advisory board members question why Senator Wagoner is pushing this legislation when he hasn't been involved with the KRSMA advisory board in the past. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF highlighted the concern that special interests could take over this advisory board, although [this legislation seems to address the concern] that agency representatives could take over the KRSMA advisory board. However, Representative Wolf pointed out that each voting member of the KRSMA advisory board resides on the Kenai Peninsula, save the ADF&G representative. He highlighted that the U.S. Forest Service representative [which is from the Cooper Landing and Moose Pass area] would lose his or her voting ability. The Cooper Landing residents were very concerned with regard to the possibility of losing their only representative on the KRSMA advisory board. Representative Wolf also highlighted that members of the community [through the KRSMA advisory board] have worked together on various issues on the Kenai River. However, he acknowledged that some have taken exception with regard to the direction of a DNR representative on the boat wake study. Representative Wolf clarified that the concern is in regard to making three [agency representatives] ex officio members, although they would remain resource managers of federal and state lands. Number 2234 REPRESENTATIVE McGUIRE surmised that if this legislation proposed such an egregious plan, then the City of Kenai wouldn't have supported it. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF explained that the City of Kenai, the City of Soldotna, and the Kenai Peninsula Borough support transferring the 536 acres into [KRSMA]. Originally, the KRSMA advisory board voted to remain quiet with regard to the change in the [agency representatives to] ex officio status. In a decision, the KRSMA advisory board supported placing the 536 acres into its management. Representative Wolf stated that these agency representatives have never controlled the KRSMA advisory board. However, changing them to ex officio status would result in special interest groups controlling the KRSMA advisory board. REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL related his belief that [even with the agency representatives being ex officio members], the agency would still have the final say because this is an advisory board. Therefore, the management is actually going to happen at the state level anyway. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF agreed. REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL said that in general he has no problem with ex officio members because he believes the expertise they bring is important. He didn't believe the expertise would be lost with ex officio members. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF reminded the committee that each of the representatives is a resident of the Kenai, and furthermore they are responsible for property along the Kenai River. Representative Wolf stated that it's unique when state and federal agencies as well as community members can both serve on a board together. Number 2371 REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL asked if an individual who works for an agency could be a member of the KRSMA advisory board and declare conflicts as is done in the legislature. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF related that under the original legislation, the member from Cooper Landing would be removed as a voting member from the KRSMA advisory board because he works for ADF&G in the summer. However, he said he wasn't sure what the amendment would do. REPRESENTATIVE COGHILL commented that an ex officio member would still have influence. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF said that the KRSMA advisory board has tried to find experience with the issues. He indicated that he is trying to protect those individuals that bring expertise to the board while fully protecting the integrity of the KRSMA advisory board. He announced that he fully supports the lands going under the KRSMA advisory board, but the [state] already owns the lands. Number 2532 CHAIR ROKEBERG turned to Amendment 1 and the insertion of the language "adjacent to the Kenai River", which would limit the makeup of the KRSMA advisory board to those living adjacent to the Kenai River. He viewed the aforementioned as problematic because it would take some people off of the advisory board and would leave other areas without representative. Chair Rokeberg inquired as to who owns the Kenai River. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF answered that the State of Alaska owns the Kenai River. In further response to Chair Rokeberg, Representative Wolf explained that EVOS owns the land that would be transferred under this legislation, although the state has the title to the land. CHAIR ROKEBERG surmised then that the citizens of Alaska own this land. Number 2592 CHAIR ROKEBERG moved that the committee adopt an amendment to Amendment 1 which would remove the insertion of the language "adjacent to the Kenai River" to page 5, line 9, and page 5, line 10. REPRESENTATIVE McGUIRE objected and remarked that she believes Chair Rokeberg is misreading this. She explained that it's a series of things and that only with regard to the municipality is the membership narrowed to refer to "adjacent to the Kenai River". CHAIR ROKEBERG withdrew his amendment to Amendment 1. REPRESENTATIVE KERTTULA opined that [Amendment 1] would take someone who is a representative of a municipality off of the advisory board. REPRESENTATIVE McGUIRE pointed out that the change Amendment 1 makes to page 5, line 10, refers to "or other interest group" and after that the legislation already says the following: "An employee, elected official, or other representative of a federal or state government may be appointed to the advisory board." Therefore, the member could be an individual who is from a municipality that isn't adjacent to the Kenai River. REPRESENTATIVE WOLF turned attention to the language "resident property owners" that Amendment 1 inserts on page 5, line 10. That language wouldn't allow an individual living in an apartment to be on the advisory board. He indicated that it would target and bring in user groups. CHAIR ROKEBERG said, "If they are apartment dwellers, a user group, or other interest group, then they'd qualify. So, I don't think that's a big problem." REPRESENTATIVE WOLF pointed out that Amendment 1 specifies "a representative of a user group". He pointed out that the Kenai Peninsula Guide Association or the United Cook Inlet Drift Association are representatives of a user group and those are [identified] as user groups. REPRESENTATIVE McGUIRE clarified that it's already the law under AS 41.21.510. CHAIR ROKEBERG maintained his objection to Amendment 1. A roll call vote was taken. Representatives McGuire, Berkowitz, Kerttula, and Coghill voted in favor of Amendment 1. Representatives Morgan and Rokeberg voted against it. Therefore, Amendment 1 was adopted by a vote of 4-2. Number 2804 REPRESENTATIVE McGUIRE moved to report HCS CSSB 190(CRA), as amended, out of committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying zero fiscal note. There being no objection, HCS CSSB 190(RLS) was reported from the House Rules Standing Committee.
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